Giving Up On Zorin

i don't talk about your options, if u work as freelancer , u r free, use ur options.
in a company u must use the tools and technologies that the team-work use it. and u will not be acceptable for their job, if u don't know the tools and technologies that they use it .
for new apps or the apps that has poor alternative in linux , i provide example for it in my post.
for .net developer, .net now is opensource aims to develop apps for all platforms(win,linux,mac,mobile ,web), and u can develop it from any environment, and visualstudio community or enterprise is allowed for mac also but not for linux.

I am not a freelancer nor is anyone who works in the "office" for me. I am a real company.

Not sure what these "technologies and tools" are that you seem to think companies use that are not available on linux are exactly.

And it is totally acceptable. There are many companies and government agencies who do not use Windows in their offices. You have a very myopic view of what is and isn't used in companies.

I noticed you edited and added apps to the above. I've never even heard of them. So I don't think they're too mainstream

Freemocap isn't even out of development yet, it's an Alpha. LOL

Do you know what an Alpha is?

Googling Paltalk, apparently that does work on Linux.

No idea what Parsic is, but I found a Parsec and that does have a linux option.

I've heard of none of these and I doubt they garner enough users for people to even care. And I would highly doubt any company would be using any of these apps nor do they seem something the mainstream would use either.

If you have an issue with software not working on Linux then I suggest you tell the makers of the software. Your complaints about software is the equivalent of me complaining on Windows because some Mac software doesn't work on Windows and Windows is horrible.

If it's open source now, then they can't stop you from developing it on linux. And you may want to re-read what you wrote because it's a contradiction.

And since it's now open source I'm sure someone somewhere will come along and start doing it. Just because you haven't been notified of them using Linux in this manner doesn't mean it doesn't happen.

You seem to be extremely unhappy using Linux, I'm not sure why you are here then if it is so awful.

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Inkscape is a Powerful Tool.
Very much so.
Professional Developers including PixArt use Blender. Blender has been used to make many Hollywood movies.

It really depends. Some companies want to keep things Uniform and require their employees to stay uniform. Some do not.
Some Government and Private companies use only Linux. Some use only Windows.
Many use both.
One of the large Major companies in the US is hiring and I have been considering joining (though it won't be until February that even begins to unfold) and they use both. You would know this company name if you heard it.
The job opening I am considering is for the Linux team.


no, u misunderstand me, I'm very happy with linux, and I'm happy i become linux user, I only talked about that 'linux will be better for other, and windows will be better for other'
u said u found freemocap in alfa, and that what i mean with new apps,when talked about windows is better for that.
the same parsic, i apended it with word 'host' in my post, there r parsic(cleint)and(host) in linux support only the cleint , and that what i mean with new apps also.
for visualstudio, i mean community and entrprise, i can use vscode for that and it is very good, but if i worked with team use the community or entriprise i will be forced for that

It certainly doesn't come off that way

And that isn't an app that has been released for use on Windows, Linux or anything else yet. That's why it is an Alpha

Regular people on Windows shouldn't even be using it. So I'm not really following this logic at all.

I didn't look at it too closely, as I don't even know what it is. I only see one download available for any of the OS's they are supporting on the website. I don't see a client or host download, just one no matter which one you choose.

Talk to the developers over at Parsec as to why they didn't create a linux host if there isn't one.

Nothing you mention though even with the obscure software you are finding is a problem on the Linux side nor does it further your argument that Windows is better. Nothing

I've been using Linux as my primary desktop since the late 90's. I've missed out on nothing in my life. I've no real issues whatsoever and even manage to run my company on it. Some things you mentioned may have well been true in early 2000, but no longer.

If a company is forcing you to use a particular software on their choice of OS, that is their choice. Not all companies do that, and whatever company you are working for that does that is not the end all be all of things. Nor is it something that all companies do, so to infer that Windows is better because of it is misguided at best.

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alpha or beta or important or not important whatever, there r apps u may wish to try it in linux ,but it's support windows only. if i were graphic design work with adobe apps , i will use win or mac for adobe apps.
for parsec , u can use steam and steam link instead of it ,or use sunshine and moonlight as alternative, but i found steam is heavey on my machine, and found a lot of bugs in sunshine.

They are not important and an alpha only being in Windows in the beginning is no indication that it will stay only in Windows. You don't even know if it will exist tomorrow.

So if any software is an Alpha only in Linux or Mac, does that make those systems better than Windows? No, of course not.

People should not just be "trying" Alpha apps anyhow. This "trying" stuff is exactly why there are so many issues that can be found right on this forum

I'm quite certain that both Linux and Mac have obscure apps as well only for their systems. This doesn't make their systems better than either.

I'm sorry, but you have not made your case at all. And using obscure apps in particular Alpha apps to make a point was not the greatest path to take.

If you wanted to make a point as to why companies use Windows, and MS Office, it isn't because of word, excel or even presentation. All of those can be easily done in Libreoffice with no problem.

The real reason is because of Outlook. Go to any forum for Linux and the reason people want Office is because of Outlook. Many companies including myself use exchange for email. MS only makes it available for Windows or Mac. Which is dumb considering they're moving to a subscription model, they're losing tons of money IMO. If you wanted to make a case for what you were saying, you should have used that, not some Alpha app nobody has even heard of.

I used to use Windows in a Virtual Box (I still have it installed) but after many hours of googling things, changing things and configuring things I finally have Evolution to a point that it is as close as I can get it to Outlook. I have now for about 2 months used Evolution for my email client instead of Outlook. Most people or companies though aren't going to spend this amount of time when Outlook works correctly right from the start. And I'm still missing some things that Outlook does and Evolution won't or can't. Thunderbird may work for some people but imap is nothing against exchange.

Would I love to have Outlook on my linux system? Yes, of course. Would I pay for it if they made it available? Yes, the first day. However I am still using linux day to day without the use of Windows just fine.

You can't use GIMP as a graphic designer for a company but you running a blog site or something like that then surly you can use. Adobe has more function than GIMP but GIMP is also not a weak tool for design.

Surely you can use other office instead of MS. It depends on your need. FreeOffice and OnlyOffice is awesome in everyway. It just depend on your need.


This is why Zorin Pro exists - by plopping down a bit of money you have access to priority support.

There are a few common issues with open source alternative OSes and they're all fairly integrated with one another..

One is money, one is userbase, and another is reliability.

First - Money.
Most operating systems have a cost, either for the ISO itself (like Windows, where you can run it on all sorts of user assembled/retail (preassembled) hardware, or OSX where your price of admission is dedicated hardware from the developers (I'm not including hackintosh because its a TINY community)

This allows the developers to provide support through a number of avenues.

Second, Userbase
There are so many "flavors" of linux, and this is further fragmented with distros that are based on bigger versions, (like Zorin, which is a customized version of Ubuntu)

This makes it difficult to get support because you can't just google something and get a thousand answers.. there might be some commonality between different flavors of Ubuntu, but often you need to chat with fellow users of your specific build, like we are doing here.
With smaller userbases there's a much smaller pool of resources

Finally, Reliability.

Due to the restrictions of the two previous items, Linux isn't as "reliable" -- it's easy to break things, and it's a lengthy process to get a new environment set up, often requiring lots of time and effort to get your hardware fully recognized and optimized, through extensive terminal inputs -- even copy / pasting text from a forum into the window doesn't always guarantee results .. there's just too many variables.

At least the community here is super responsive and open to "noobs" -- I've abandoned Linux in the past soley due to getting flamed on forums by seasoned pro's flaming me and telling me to "git gud" before coming back. Now this is predominantly due to amazing community members like @Aravisian and those like them, but it shouldn't be taken for granted like you might with Windows or OSX support

The Pro option should be seen as both an opportunity to support devs (for existing seasoned Linux users) as well as a viable option for noobs who want to get white-glove support, and effectively
"buy" the OS like they would with any other mainstream operating system


I don't find this to be case at all. I find people who have to constantly ask for help it is because they go about "tinkering" with their system not knowing what they're doing and for in the end zero purpose. They start touching everything, then want others to tell them how to fix it when they can't even tell you what they've touched. This would be the same even on Windows though.

Totally disagree, and can not say that enough. I installed Linux Mint 21 a few weeks ago and took me all of about 15 minutes. You're still on your first reboot with Windows in 15 minutes.

If you set your system up properly the first time, you can reinstall or install another distro easily. I have a home partition where all my files reside so as long as I use the same the username and password everything is right there as soon I'm done installing.

I opened up FF and everything was already there. There was no copy and pasting, no setting up this and that requiring lots of time at all.

If you have to go through all that when re-installing then you don't have your system set up properly in the first place and you didn't follow any instructions.

Personally I think the biggest problem with Linux in regards to users is that they don't want to search for anything nor read anything. Someone will run into trouble or not know how to do something, first thing they do is post in a forum and wait for someone to come along to tell them step by step over looking it up, reading and learning how to do it for themselves. You don't learn anything if someone else is always giving you the solution.

The second thing IMO is this notion that Linux will work on anything you throw at it. No, it won't. If you try loading a distro on a 15 year old piece of equipment you're bound to have issues. This mantra of bring back old hardware to life needs to stop.


This is true... For Me.
When I first migrated to Linux from Windows, I got into Root and tinkered a lot. I deleted or modified at will.
I ran commands that I had no idea how they were formulated in terminal. I did not learn how to construct commands, I trusted others I found, some quite outdated.
I reinstalled Zorin OS so much that I became an expert at preserving my data.
And I lot a lot of personal data a few times, too.
I learned the hard way, each step of the way.

I now tinker in root... Even More than I did then.
But I only reinstall when I feel like giving myself a fresh start. I almost never have any problems. Because now I have learned to check what I am doing, to understand what the file is and how it works. The easy breakage stopped - when I stopped breaking things.

From this vantage point:

Both statements are valid and true. They only appear to contradict each other. But they don't.
As a new Linux user, I felt as though Linux was easier to break because it was. I had More Control than I did with Windows and more access.
To the novice or moderately experienced user I am today, I see it more as DeanG does: Be knowledgeable and responsible with the power and control Linux gives you in order to solve the problem.

Windows conditions us to Sacrifice Control in favor of "easy" and "Convenient" and "Not having to learn or think..."
Most coming to Linux are still in that conditioned mindset.

We could meet that demand and try to make Linux Easy... Or... We could teach and encourage and inspire them to believe in themselves. To learn and understand that they can do it.

I agree with most of your post @th3ass3t
But I also have installed many different Desktop Environments. They were all quite straight-forward and simple and worked out of the box.
The only one that gave me trouble was Plasma D.E. It's a lot... and installing it was easy.
Getting rid of it wasn't.
None of that required extensive terminal input.
Most hardware works out of the box. But not all and not always. Here on the forum, we see the users that run into trouble. Considering that the Zorin Users run into the millions, if download numbers are to be believed, then the few we see are how indicative it is that the vast majority of the time, It Works On Install.

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