GTK dropping X11

Not my take, though. The fingerpointing came from a post I was reading on the topic.

Hid the quoted post because it looked too big:

As the GTK project notes on Fedi:

The X11 backend being deprecated mainly means that we’re not going to spend time implementing new features, like dmabuf, graphics offloading, or Vulkan support. X11 support will still exist until GTK4 is EOL, which will happen once GTK 6 is released. We’re talking about a 20 years horizon, at this point…

[…]

Of course, somebody could show up tomorrow, and implement everything that the Wayland backend does, but for X11. We can always undeprecate things. We are not holding our breath, though…

↫ The GTK project on Fedi

This is the right move, and I’m glad the GTK project is doing this, and is giving everyone ample time to prepare. A lot of people will still freak out, get mad, and scream bloody murder at certain individuals in the wider Linux community, and those people are, of course, free to start working on Xorg. Like the GTK developers, though, I’m not holding my breath, because despite years of excessive Wayland hate, not a single person has stood up to do the work required to keep Xorg going.

Source of the Article I Quoted Above

True true!!! zenzen raises a point I was overlooking, let's not forget the origins of Wayland! Surely the people the split off from X11 should be pointing the fingers at themselves for not investing in X11.

Then what is that right there ^ ??

Very true and the natural course of things. Over years and decades, a code base gets bogged down with constant improvements, keeping up with modern developments while maintaining backward compatibility, the security arms race, etc.

Then comes a generation more pampered than their forebears that is like: "Wouldn't it be nice if I could make all this go away?? Rather than trying to understand any of this, it's far quicker just to make something new!" Then everyone praises this streamlined new code base and all the "problems" it solves. It will get these exact problems the longer people use it too until it eventually becomes the beast it sought to replace.

EDIT Personally that is why I am glad I am using Linux now. It doesn't take much of using Linux to see you are really not dependent on any distribution or operating system merchant or software or as @Aravisian so aptly put it:

So I think the best thing the average Linux user can do is Be Like Swarf. @swarfendor437 is always making tutorials, overviews, Manuals, useful things for people - you can call them the "Linux Community" but lets call them what they really are - "People In General". Let's keep up and broaden these efforts of learning things that we can then share with others, so they will be educated in alternative methods to the Maintainer Control that may try to creep into OUR systems and THEIR systems.

A sneaky Distortion of my Comment, hahaha!

But to be serious: I'm really not the Type of Person who use Smiley's or Emoji's in general. It isn't mine. It is not my Way of Expression. But to say it clear: not my Way. How others do that is of course up to them.

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Interesting conversation. I am team X11, only cause I know it works on my machine, and I have no interest in breaking things. If Zorin keeps X11 in the upcoming OS18, I will continue to use it.

If not, and I'm forced to use Wayland, I'll pray to the microchip gods that my computer from 2021 is modern enough to use Wayland without black screening. lol


With Wayland Implementation in a more modern Desktop Environment Version it should work better. You could try it with an Ubuntu STS Release or Fedora for Example. But we will see what Gnome Version comes with Zorin 18.

I... really... can only repeat myself:

Have a look at this users screenshot.

It shows he is on Wayland.
Modern. It's Wayland. It tells you so. Wayland.
That means that he is using a Modern Protocol Interface that has removed the Server in the middle allowing direct communication between Hardware and kernel.
That is why Server is blank... Wait. Isn't it blank? It's not...
server: X.org
Hold up. Using X11 server? I thought he was on Wayland.
Oh...
with: XWayland v.22.1.1
Monitor-1: XWayland-0

Wayland... is not working. And it is unable to do what it claims to do: Provide the direct communication with hardware to the kernel without the server. It can for some things.
For everything else, it uses X.org X11 and XServer behind the scenes, giving the illusion that you are on Wayland and that it is working. By using the Xserver and X11 it claims to replace.
We are not talking about a few rebellious apps that refuse to give over to Wayland, here. That is is his Monitor Hardware.

This is just as true on Modern Hardware with the Latest Distro and Latest Gnome. I have used them, too. XWayland using the Xserver with X11 backend to fill in all of Waylands voids. Ask the user what they are using: They answer just "Wayland." No... They are using Xserver.

Deceptive Practice

So... Microsoft started doing this thing with Windows: Fast Boot.

Fast boot makes your computer boot up in just a few seconds. Nice.

No, it doesn't. It tells you it is Boot but it is not boot, there is no init - it is a Deception.
It hibernates the computer instead of shutting it down when you tell it to Shut Down. Then it just wakes from Hibernate instead of booting. And what does this deception do? Cause a bunch of problems. And the End User no longer has control over the ShutDown procedure.

See, I do not know about you.

But I am tired of being deceived. Tricked. Made a fool of.
I gave Microsoft my back and turned away from that.

Why would I allow it here?

That is not irrational "Wayland hate" like others want to call it to dodge and deceive. The facts: Are listed right up above.

I wrote ''in a more mordern Desktop Environment''. Zorin doesn't have that. Zorin 17 uses Gnome 43. But the more modern Version are 46 and 47. That is the Reason why I gave @StarTreker as Examples Ubuntu STS and Fedora. The same for Plasma.

And the Wayland Implementation depends on the Desktop Environments and the Software. Let's take xfce as a good Example. They prepare there Step to Wayland. How they do that? They don't go over the XWayland Way and bring that directly into Wayland. Takes more Time but at the end it should be way smoother. Or look at Cosmic. They programmed it directly for Wayland.

How ironic, precisely now that Google is (slowly) making a real taskbar and window management in recent android versions when used on tablets and laptops for feature parity with chromeOS

It will be quite funny and sad to see the heaviest linux DE having even less features than a clean AOSP Android. I really wonder why is it the go-to DE for being default (and sometimes only choice) on a lot of major distros (Ubuntu, Zorin, Fedora, VanillaOS...)

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I think a lot of people are watching Cosmic with great interest.