Installed page/tab was blank, but it is back now. Yeah that works fine for me, when it is not mysteriously blank. I have to have that list working %100 of the time - can't ever have it be blank.
Maybe it blanked out and had to repopulate because of the base upgrade of Zorin I did earlier?
One of the primary goals that I personally have on this forum is to help acquaint and educate new users to Linux. This becomes increasingly difficult the more the user resists the Terminal.
The terminal is the go-to tool, exceptionally powerful and versatile. It is also one of the easiest tools you can use. Windows discourages the use of the terminal (command prompt) allowing Windows More Control Over You. Without the use of this powerful tool, you are isolated away from many commands you can enter.
I can only encourage you at this point to re-think how you view the terminal. We can help bring familiarity and ease of use to it. We cannot, however, undo Windows Training. Only you can choose to do that.
I linked to you in another thread an Introductory Thread to the Terminal in Linux.
Why Windows wants control: By keeping users in the dark about command functions and how to take control of their computer; Windows can push through any updates without accountability; including Monitoring and Spyware. Did you know that in the later versions of Windows, that Microsoft was using your PC as their server to disseminate Updates? They reduced their server load, by using the machine you own.
The less the user knows how to control their own machine, the more control MS has.
On Linux, you get both. You have your cake and eat it, too. Linux has much in the way of GUI, but also affords the Raw Power of the command of Terminal. Coming from Windows means only that is where your beginnings were. In migrating to Linux, you can expand your horizons. You started out on the go-cart with the automatic transmission and have now elevated yourself to the Corvette 6-speed manual. If you wanted to be using Windows - you would be. Something brought you here.
Or... I could say:
Listen, You Are Using Linux. Not Windows.
While we can cover instant and effective removals in the terminal, you state clearly that you want a GUI app:
Synaptic Package Manager.
You can install it from terminal to get you started:
sudo apt install synaptic
Synaptic will never blank out the way the Software Boutique does (I never use the Software Store)... Synaptic is solid, steady and reliable. It issues many of the same terminal commands you would, except from a GUI setting. It is powerful, which means it appears complex. Don't worry, like everything that you start out learning, you can have it handled just fine.
Use the Search Button on the top toolbar to search for the package you will want to remove. It will produce the list. Select the item and it will suggest the installed packages that can safely be removed along with it. Then click the
apply button on the top toolbar to remove the item.
The problem with Windows add/remove is that it gives no information, does not offer to remove clutter, bloat or extra packages nor does it relay pertinent information to the user. Windows cites 'making it easy' as their primary reason for keeping you in the dark and out of control. Always remember that.
Whenever you feel like, "But Windows didn't make me have to think..." Recall the reason you needed to look elsewhere for your computing needs.
Oi... I guess I should have done an introductory thread here. I will rectify that after this. But first...
I want you to step into my head fro a second. Comfy? We will use a simple, relatable illustration to accustom you to how I think.
There are two main 3D Modeling software packages out there in the world. 3DS Max and Blender. We will ignore Maya for now. Blender is SUPER powerful, its free, you can do anything with it including video editing and creating games. BUT the interface was designed by Lucifer himself. It has been getting better, or I am getting more used to it every time I open the program up. But it is still almost exactly the same experience the average person would have if they were plopped down into the cockpit of a helicopter and told to fly it. And Blender users are PROUD that learning how to use it is akin to learning how to decipher Egyptian hieroglyphics. Or more accurately. that strange book they found with the language nobody can understand.
3DS Max on the other hand is intuitive to use despite its complexity. You can be up and running making things in no time, and if you get stuck you will NEVER, EVER run out of forums, tutorials, videos and so forth. It's even taught in some schools! Granted, Discreet or whoever owns it now is a greedy, money grubbing corporation in every way. But at least the interface won't have you resisting the urge to pluck out your own eyeballs.
Now if I want to design some architecture for a game, I DO NOT want to spend a couple of years navigating a learning curve! I want to be able to use my tool as effortlessly and quickly as possible. It is all about bringing that thing in my mind's eye out into the world. EVERYTHING, and I mean EVERYTHING, has to be out of my way! I can't spend any time learning the OS or navigating obstacles. My tools have to be as ready to use as they would be in any shop hanging on the wall. I open them up the program and start CREATING, MAKING.
Linux may be better than Windows, and you make a number of good points for it. I appreciate that. But I would rather drive on the Nürburgring ring than the middle of Rome, Italy. I don't just want, I NEED, a smooth transition to opening my tools and using them. It has to be as simple as picking up a pencil and a notebook. I am unwilling to spend even a single second navigating any complexity at all.
When I sit down to begin making stuff on the computer, I am sitting down to make stuff on the computer. Not learning how to use the computer, then the OS, then the software and any other myriad of things. I stuck with Windows because that is what I knew, much like I stuck with 3DS Max. I did make the move to Blender, but I have also not made any 3D content for years. I just stopped being able to level design and make 3D Models.
I am moving to Linux because I know about the automatic updates that Windows 10 forces. One of the reasons I stuck with 7. And I don't doubt that a lot of what you said is true. But it doesn't matter. Because Windows is the easiest and quickest way to get me to what I have a computer for, right now playing Minecraft and creating content. But Windows 7 is increasingly getting shut out, so I either move to Linux or Windows 10, and Linux is the most ethical choice. I am able to consider it because I can use it almost as easily as Windows to get to what I want to do.
HOWEVER, I am brutal with my OSes! I am constantly maintaining and tweaking things. Constantly trying new programs. So I can't have any stoplights when it comes to managing them. I have to be able to access a list of them 24/7 and I have to be able to uninstall things or do whatever I need quickly. Commands, no matter how powerful, are not quick. You have to learn them, you have to memorize them, you have to spend time in the command prompt typing them, and that is taking too much of my time. Plus I am finding it harder and harder to remember everything. If I have to relearn stuff it becomes even worse.
So to summarize... If you are a carpenter your dream shop has lots of room so you can easily move around, and your tools are all hanging on the wall, ready for you to use. You want to get in there and start woodworking.
If you are anything like me, using the computer as your creative outlet, you want a nice, easy to navigate layout with your tools right there, ready for you to use.
I hope that clears things up a bit... I am moving to Linux because my reasons for not doing so have been mostly invalidated, and it is the ethical choice. Instead of having to install a custom version of Windows 10 with all the garbage cut out, I can use Linux. I am giving it a try. But I have certain needs, certain requirements it will have to meet, and I am unable and unwilling to spend any time lost in a learning curve. The simple fact of the matter is that If it is easier for me to install a custom version of Windows 10 to do what I want, I will. That's just how it is.
I am an artist and am very visually oriented. I am also an architect and designer. I respond to my environment. I am ALSO an empath or HSP. So my OS can't be a blinking cursor with a lot of text and commands I have to look up, or require me to spend a lot of time in front of it doing anything like that. It is literally an anathema to me!
Hope you understand me better now. Now let's step back outside my head. I normally don't allow visitors back there!
I also use Blender, so I can quickly relate to where you are coming from. In fact, I have used Blender as an example, myself.
I am not a programmer or developer... I am a mechanic. And, you clearly have a good understanding of tooling. My tools are hanging on the wall, not tucked away in drawers.
I think you made a very good analogy. Expanding upon it; If I led any random stranger into my shop, with all my tools open access, can they rebuild a carburetor? Can they rebuild an alternator? Can they replace piston rings? Can they replace the wrist-pin knuckles?
Can they differentiate between Horsepower and Torque? Calculate the proper gear ratios?
Let's say I have a Dana 7:2 with a Line 6 180hp, what size gear do I need on the speed sensor to ensure that the speedometer will get an accurate reading?
Will they use my torque wrench to properly set-to-spec the head bolts? Or will they use the ratchet and make them crazy tight, stretching the threads? From block to head, does a Ford Flathead produce: 50 ft/lbs, 3,000 ft/lbs or 130,000 ft/lbs of force?
If you put a voltmeter to my battery with the engine running under a load, what voltage should you see if the alternator is good?
I could go on... But I think you get the idea: That having a tool in front of you does not grant you the knowledge to know which tool is the right tool for the job, to properly use them or to have any idea of what else to do.
It is intuitive, looking at an open-ended wrench, to know that can fit on a bolt, not a cam lock- but what is the difference between an Adjustable Wrench, a box wrench or an open end? What is the application that makes a box wrench different from the open end?
I am sure that we both know that you have always experienced that uncertainty, with every program, every piece of software, every application. The moment where guessing based on intuitive design falls short and you have no idea how to work the thing. If you have been modding Minecraft, then you know exactly what I mean. And if you learned to write Minecraft mods, then you had to learn how to code, first.
Linux comes with a learning curve. While we on this forum can do our best to encourage you, to smooth the sharpest stones to help you walk the path as best you can, we cannot change the fundamental nature of Linux to meet your demands. To go back to the example of Blender; the Blender developers are proud of their toolbox. This is because their toolbox steers the user into using all of the toolbox, unlocking all of Blenders potential rather than just using the basic tools, getting about 30% of its potential... and being satisfied with just that. With a bit of pressure, the Blender toolbox pushes the user into tackling the challenges and Learning More.
A person who is halted by "not knowing;" or averse to learning, can get no-where. And you know this, because you have had to learn a lot to get to where you are today. How to format videos for YouTube, how to use Video editors, how to code and so on.
Where this leaves us: With enough money, you can convince any developer to write software that does all the work for you. You can even use advances in technology to make software almost seem to read your mind. To achieve this, the developers must be very well paid. Microsoft turned over $2 trillion in revenue recently.
Canonical turned over $110 million.
If Microsoft is WALL-E, then Linux is Mad Max.
Being a developer you already dedicated yourself to constant learning. Once you become familiar with linux you would smack yourself in the head and ask "why did I fight this?". The terminal is not as horrible as you see it, and can even improve your productivity (since the majority of applications integrate commands that aren't available in the gui). You may have the majority of your code automatically written, but it is something you still must view and manipulate, I'm sure.
Then you shouldn't have come to linux. Anything new is going to have a learning curve, there is no avoiding it. Even a custom version of windows 10 will have a learning curve, because they may have removed things that were integrated with the "bloat" you loathe. So you will have to find a different solution for some issues you will no doubt have there. Either way, you are looking at a learning curve. Not being open minded to learning is doing yourself a disservice.
You're asking us to be like you to help you, but that isn't going to work. You don't go to the mechanic and ask them to fix your car, tell them not to use pneumatic or hydraulics and expect it to be done in an hour, do you? You tie our hands when you want something done a specific way. We use the terminal to troubleshoot and fix issues. It is the fastest and most informational process. I'm sorry that this is uncomfortable for you, but you can use this as a learning tutorial that will be over when you have your setup issue free (at least for a time). Then you will be as productive, if not more so, than windows. Fighting this process binds our hands and drags out the ability to help you with your issues. It may not be something you're used to, but if you bare with the assistance we provide, voluntarily by the way, you will be up and running faster.
I don't understand the aversion now, when we have been helping you this way on all of your other issues and this has barely been an issue. A little patience and an open mind will get more accomplished than complaining about our choice of the fastest, easiest method to resolve your issues.
You can also begin to search things for yourself, Zorin 16 is based on Ubuntu 20.04. Solutions for your issues can be found with an internet search. By the way, the majority of the solutions you find will be by terminal. It's just the way it is.
For the record, with my 6+ years of Linux experience, Zorin OS, Feren OS, Makulu Lindoz, POP OS, I've never memorized all the terminal commands either. If I have to install, remove, or update software via the terminal, I'll copy and paste commands in from sites I get through web searches.
Yes, and I think it goes without saying, I make sure those are reputable sites, ones that are secure of course.
But most of the time, Synaptic Package Manager works for me, and there is no need. Sometimes, certain software won't even be in the repo, either cause the repo hasn't been added to the OS, or the software never was in the repo to begin with.
In cases like that, you can install via a DEB file. And some software comes with their own installers just like Windows believe it or not. I recently downloaded GIFCURRY form Github via a ZIP file, which contained an installer in there.
But I also understand where you are coming from, you just want to start it up and go. And that is one of the reasons why big companies have IT guys and gals, their responsible for making sure all the computers in the company are able to do just that for you.
EDIT: One more thing, notice how all of us are running over here to help you, for free? When was the last time you saw Microsoft do that for its customers? Even 21-years ago, if you wanted support from Microsoft, you had to pay like 100-dollars for a service call. 21-years later, I bet they charge 200 an hour now for service calls.
Yes, I have noticed this is an AWESOME little Linux community over here. One of the first things I looked for is a good forum, and everyone here is awesome!
Ok so Software store in Zorin is pretty trash, you can use the terminal with
sudo apt list or you can just install another store,
sudo apt install synaptic. To install
.deb files with terminal, u can use
sudo dpkg -i <- if your installation fails, you can type
sudo apt --fix-broken install <- this usually fixes the problem with broken .deb installs, if ur install still fails you can ask the forum.
Yep, thats what the Linux community is all about, we help each other, provide support, and some of us even provide emotional support during these tough times.
Also, some in the Linux community, also fight for the right to repair. And Linux in general, is all about providing you the choice. We believe the user has the right to choose, not a company.
Glad your having fun over there DreamBliss, cause once you get the hang of Linux, it can be fun.
I must agree with you StarTreker
My learning curve started with a Ti994/A computer, this in turn involved learning "basic" language then "ext. Basic".,Then Ms Dos , Windows right up to 10, and a bit of linux in between.
I have been enjoying zorin 16 Pro and dont mind using either terminal or GUI, but and yes there is a "BUT", i find it odd to have a very nice looking software store that the features of updating,removing and exploring works fine for the apps that are listed in the store, to clarify, one of the apps i use i had to download as a DEB file. After installing, it is not listed in the software store, to uninstall it i need to use the terminal, if you right click on it in the "zorin menu"and then click on "Show Details", the answer you get is(Sorry there are no details for that application} .I find this very odd and hope that someone a bit more savvy then me can find a solution.
I prefer Synaptic Package Manager for a GUI package manager.
sudo apt install synaptic
Generally, I do most installations (by far) from the terminal. Synaptic is handy when I need it mostly for removals.
The Gnome-Software app follows the same pattern as all other Gnome-apps: Minimalist and Broken. Gnome is much like Microsoft, treating the user as incapable and unintelligent and limits user control and access.
The only reason I keep gnome-software installed on this system is to assist users on this forum with troubleshooting. Otherwise, I would have wiped it off the computer by now with a thermonuclear warhead.
One handy way of being able to remove .deb files that are independently installed by the user is: When you install a .deb package, create a new folder in your Downloads directory and label it something like:
Once you install the .deb package, move that .deb file into that
Then when you wish to remove that package, double click that same .deb package you installed with to pull up the manager that will offer to remove it.
The above method can take up some extra space, though.
To be honest, you don't need to keep the .deb files. If you want to remove them, just
sudo apt remove #the program you installed via .deb.
.deb files also update like normal applications anyways so you rly don't need the
.deb file. So just delete the
.deb after installation, it's fine.
I have used Synaptic Package Manager before, and i agree that yes it does the job its meant to do, but in my option just doesn't stack up to the look of the software store.
I have Synaptic, but I mostly use the terminal because I got used to using it.
My analogy would be:
Software Store = Sweet (Candy) Shop
Synaptic = Tool Shop
I think the best store I actually used was actually
Pamac-gtk from Manjaro. I loved how Pamac looked, and it was fast and user-friendly. It also allowed access to the AUR, Flatpak, Snaps and of course the Manjaro Repo. Even tho I switched away from Manjaro, no other store I tried have beaten
Pamac-gtk as my favorite store I used.
Welcome to the candy shop, where we are your 1 stop shop. So many sweets, everything your heart's desire, today we have a sale on cinnamon sticks with XFCE flavor in the middle.
Just watch out for Snaps in that sweet shop, they are really bad for your teeth.
Yes. You would need to know the exact name of it, though. Do you remember each name of each .deb you have installed? The above keeps a record, allowing easy access and removal.
I understand the aesthetic side - I theme mine out to make it look good. But, what matters more? Functional, stable complete control? Or something looking kinda nice (If not minimalistic which is not a good thing) but not stably working?