Moderatorship Requires Review From Zorin Devs

Chat about Zorin
#1

@AZorin @zorink

What happened here began as a misunderstanding. But after I tried to clarify, Aravisian continued to make claims that I was doing something wrong. In his typical bullying fashion, he shut me up, closed his thread, and put in his last word as he always does.

His bullying tactics require review. I think he's out of control and he's been acting like a tyrant. He's caused many members to leave. He's caused many previous issues with me.

I always like to hear the opinions on Linux in general, and more specifically, Zorin OS, who have been Windows users.

Having said that however, I personally value the opinions on Linux more, if it's coming from an IT professional. I simply meant, that if a person in such field came on the forum, if they began their introduction post, stating that the have a background in IT, as they are a certified IT professional in a certain area, I would be very interested in what they think of Zorin OS especially in comparison to Windows.

That's all I meant. But no, Aravisian had to twist this into something nafarious, as if I'm done kind of villain, so that he could have his little drama tyrade.

Everybody is afraid to admit it. But I'll be the one to say it. Aravisian, you are out of control. And you need to stop. Your like a wrecking ball destroying everything in your path.

I'm leaving this forum permanently this time. Many others have left to get away from you. I will be too. But I won't allow you to go on bullying others, it has to stop.

#2

When it comes to misunderstandings, it often takes two parties:

Here in this quote from your post below, your wording implies that I made up the anecdote and you need that person to join the forum and provide credentials to "prove" that she is "the real deal."

It's perfectly possible that is not how you meant it at all... However, these are the words you chose. That is the impression.
I then asked what credentials have to do with judging the aesthetics of a theme... Which is a perfectly reasonable question.
You then made a personal accusation and it was preferable to Close the thread and prevent a fight.
When closing a thread, the member closing the topic must explain their reason.

I think this would carry more weight if you name the members or link to the incidents.
It makes sense that some members that repeat infractions and repeatedly get moderated will step away from the forum. Recently, @Michel has been notably absent after I needed to address repeated posts he had made, including toward yourself. It is a loss for the forum as much as a necessary address. Sadly, that is how things sometimes work out.

I actually agree with you about a review being reasonable. In fact, I had posted something in exasperation along those lines in the Moderator Forum when I noted the thread closure.

I personally think that the thread stands on its own merit. Misunderstandings in Online Discussions can happen. Or choice in wording may give the wrong impression.
But it really is best to try avoid the personal accusations or attacks such as assuming the "Intentional desire to find fault" Or being a bully or Drama or Tirade in such a manner; a wrecking ball blasting through the forum...
I understand you are upset over a thread - that made two of us as I needed to calm down after those posts, too.
And getting outsider review or opinions can really help, too.

From this point forward, I will let others address your concerns in this thread.

Should you decide to remain on the forum and forget the Forum Guidelines for a moment, those who are Moderators cannot afford to Pick favorites. You must also take Personal Responsibility for the words that you choose, the same as Michel. The same as me.

#3

I am sorry to see this between the two of you. I have gotten great help from both of you. I personally did not see anything wrong with desiring a professional opinion about Linux or anything else. If I was interested in buying a particular car i would much rather ask an experienced mechanic than my neighbor who has never worked on a car his opinion. And as far as asking for credentials I think all of us know there are many people on the internet claiming to be what they are not. Just my 2 cents.

3 Likes
#4

@cifta, if you could please, explain what credentials and qualifications the mechanic may show you that would permit their opinion on the color of the car. Or the Body design aesthetics.

#5

I don't understand what happened, there must be something else going on between them. But I particularly dislike this phrase:

You wanted everyone to see this didn't you, why else open a new thread? If this was a simple misunderstanding all you have to do is apologize and walk away. You are playing victim for no reason.

Regardless of why I or anyone thinks, the fact of the matter is that Aravisian is no tyrant. That's a statement of truth. Suffice to scroll through the forum to see daily responses to all kind of issues people have.

And I hope you can come back and simply accept that something unpleasant and unintentional happened. We're all having a good time and learning over here, let's not spoil that.

#6

Such a pity, I like Both of you very much, oh well, sh*t happens.

#7

I have just read the other thread. It started off OK but then escalated and crashed after the "qualifications" bit. I perceive overreaction on both sides, rather than a clear misunderstanding, but what do I know. Not something to quit over IMO.
Tolerance can be a virtue?

1 Like
#8

Have to concur. With several of the replies.

A very accurate comment.

This reminds me of my last relationship. She had twins, Girl & Boy. Fought constantly. Drove me crazy. I would "punish" them. Make them hold hands.
Make them give hugs and say to the other, I Love You. Even did the, being a big guy myself, putting them into 1 T-Shirt where they each got one arm out and have them do something together and if completed they could take off the t-shirt. They'd have no choice but to work together. And they'd be laughing at the end. I wish I could do the same here. Make these 2 create a Theme called 'Collaboration'. Let @StarTreker pick the style, fonts & colors and have @Aravisian use his magical powers to create it. But we're all adults, and with some on the verge. Enough is enough guys. Just agree to disagree. No need to insult, embarrass or make accusations. I will speak on behalf of many, we don't need the drama. This is not what this forum is about.
If I wanted to see this, I'd turn on MSM.

Does 4 weeks sound like a enough time to see the results of 'Collaboration'?
Because THAT is something we'd want to see on here..!!!

2 Likes
#9

Perceptive.
I think that it is human nature to "see the negatives" in someones intentions sometimes. I also think it is a lot easier to look at something objectively, if you are not the one feeling attacked.
I kind of caught this one from both sides.
One party was questioning the other party that was relayed; that party was questioning the merit of having to post a lot of personal information to validate themselves, at risk of having that nitpicked and doubted.
For a thread that was really just amusing in its point: There is no standard of beauty.

It is very important that we appreciate our diversity and different tastes and styles in themes. I may dislike a theme that another user is using. He thinks it is beautiful and I think it is ugly. But I must not ever comment that it is ugly. To him, that is the same as suggesting that there is something wrong with him for liking something that is ugly (especially farcical if it is only ugly to me.) This is something I confront on here a lot.

It is very important that any member can publicly and openly address concerns or request review. Just as the first statement in this post: Outside observations can really help.
No one ever enjoys being moderated. Being a moderator sometimes means having to be a bit mean. It heightens defensiveness and emotions. Which is why it is often best to close a thread (Temporarily or permanently) if productive discourse is unlikely to happen. It makes a lot of sense that members can begrudge some moderation. I know I have at times. And Yes, I have been moderated on here plenty, too. Because I'm not perfect and not a robot.

And to all: Please help this out by avoiding using this thread to bash any member.
Having and addressing observations and concerns is fine: But I do have a certain amount of fear as to what a thread can go off the rails into. No one is perfect. Everyone overreacts sometimes. And no one reads things on the internet without getting angry time to time or even taking it personal. We all sit here in our similar humanity. And our diversity.

StarTreker has done a great job on the forum, lately. But every person has a tipping point and there is a lot of tension. Multiple issues from a thread that Treker flagged believing it was a scam, an incident of a member being frustrated over Trekers Spelling, an incident with Wine, an incident with a Printer driver installation... The common element in these incidents is - The Involvement of a Moderator (Me) that is caught in the middle of these incidents due to necessity. It makes sense that I would I likely will draw the continued ire of Treker as I am a constant source of frustration or even - moderating.
So...

Understanding and reaching understanding can work pretty well, too.
A little sleep can help, also.:stuck_out_tongue:

4 Likes
#10

Everyone are diffrent and everyone have a good days and bad days. Important to not be a behaviour impuls where our decision could be like a lighting. Balance and yoga to be understand and a share a patient. @Aravisian I believe have experience with that where some topic on forum or subject could be from a little a fire to big hell where is important not expose to vulkan. I mean sometimes better a cut something but if someone want forward some topic then this a person can create a subject topic and if find some people to good conversation about diffrents with a salt and respectfull and culture then why not? I mean diffrents linux and another things how working? Sorry for my bad english.

1 Like
#11

Your english came across 'Perfect' to me Bourne...

#12

for this forum to be THE ZORIN FORUM, we need @StarTreker and @Aravisian both, because you two make my day everytime i read.
#weneedboth

6 Likes
#13

I appreciate any support users. I have respectfull when they sacrifice time to help us. Sometimes some topic for someone could not taste perfectly but we are family Zorin users. @Aravisian is very active and his way is diplomatic with argument. I was was old forum and appreciate how many wiek everyone gived for users tips with working Zorin on any hardware.

#14

What happened? I do not know. Why will you leave this forum?

#15

I don't leave this forum.

#16

I think @Der_Panzer was referring to Treker, not you. But didn't make it clear.

1 Like
#17

The best option sometimes is take a break. What I can sayed after Zorin 16 was released was many people. Now is a couple people. So this is like a new version released then this is like a storm and then when it finished then it comes a sunshine day with peace where most people are on holiday. I don't understand one how to many years exist Zorin on the world and some new distribution have better reputation on another forums. Someone paying them? Linux always will be diffrent from another operating system. Freedom to creating what you want.

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#18

I asked what happened to @StarTreker. Why he wants to leave this forum.

#19

@Der_Panzer It could be a two ways. First he is tired with people who attacked him. Some people gived many years for some forums and planning to leave to more gived time in real life and tired. Linux is evolved but have always new problems because always is changing. People could be tired that to learning and searching a problems. It also could be a many forums and websides gived also answear. For me i understand him, he gived and sacrifice many years on this forum. Ubuntu always have the same problems. People taken another distributions. If people out from somewhere that means two ways. People in real life have a hard life and trying find peace and help another. If they not accepted in virtual life then they are out to not to be "toxic". They are know better myself. This is something you sayed: " Something wrong with you" - you must change that and that. They cannot accepted that want to leave if the people thinking they are "toxic". It going two ways. If you don't want to be hurt then don't abuse or hurt another people. Rules on forum are clearly.

1 Like
#20

I felt sad when I heard he/she was leaving the forum. I hope he/she just stops for a while (for a day off or something) and doesn't leave the forum forever.