Setting permissions / ownership

General Help
#8

If it's mounted from boot, edit your fstab file and include the octal permission there. Any changes made to the permissions would be overridden by the fstab.

By making it accessible for any os YOU may install, you are essentially saying you don't want any security at all and you are fine with anyone having access to your files. Windows already does this fine. You needn't change anything there. Linux on the other hand, it would require a lot to bypass or disable the security, something I am not comfortable helping you do. It's there for a reason. The entire system is based around it. While it may be inconvenient at times, what you ask would be no different than running a windows machine as administrator (which most do) allowing anything to install or have access without you even knowing (RansomWare anyone).

I'm curious, are you also frustrated by doors, locks and other such inconveniences that keep your physical property safe?

For the most part you have access. If you need to modify something in a directory, you can use sudo for that.

I have been dual-booting windows/Zorin now for two years. I have an ntfs partition mounted as a data share. When writing to the root of the partition it requires a password. Anything else doesn't. I am using the default permissions that the kernel wrote to fstab. I access windows and linux directories without issue, including my windows C: drive.

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#9

Apologies, I don't know what that means. I'm after a procedure/command to make sure my personal data files on my data drive (not my OS files on the OS drive) will be fully "owned" by me even if I have to install a new OS, or move to a new PC.

#10

No, they make sense. But the problem with an OS and the concept of a "user" is that each OS has no way of knowing that actually user x on OS 1 and user y on OS 2 are the same person. In reality I am the owner of the data files and folders; but each OS inevitably thinks each "owner" is a different person, so locks the others out.

Suppose each room in my house had a different lock. And if I changed the decoration of my entrance hall, suddenly my keys no longer worked to get into the other rooms. That's what can happen if I try to access my files via another OS. It makes no sense to me, and causes problems. I already couldn't access my files once in the last week due to this.

#11

[quote="337harvey, post:8, topic:11019"]
By making it accessible for any os YOU may install, you are essentially saying you don't want any security at all and you are fine with anyone having access to your files. [/quote]

Well, all I want is for me to not be prevented from accessing my own personal files - music, documents, pictures etc. I don't know what security settings are required for that. But if I transfer files to my writing laptop or back, I don't want them to be locked as "not mine". If I have to boot via an emergency USB I don't want to be prevented from accessing and backing up my own files. If there is a way of doing that without giving full access to everyone, fine. But as far as I can tell, any scenario that restricts others, also created potential scenarios where I can't access my own data. That is a far bigger risk for me.

#12

Note that I'm not talking about the OS drive, system files, programs etc - the equivalent of the C:. I am only talking about my own files, the data drive (D:). The default OS file settings would be unchanged, the OS would be applying protection just the same. I just want to make sure I don't lose access to the files my life depends on, just because another OS I install on a different PC (or the same one) thinks I am a different person.

If I have Zorin and Mint dual booting on my PC, I don't want the draft of a novel written on one of them to be restricted when I uninstall that OS and only access the file from the other. Likewise when I transfer the file to my writing laptop, or share a file with an editor, of pass some photos on to my family, or get a new PC and transfer all my files. Any restriction that stops the files working properly in those scenarios is a problem, hence me wanting to make sure that doesn't apply to my personal data files. Over the last 20 years I have installed or reinstalled nine different operating systems across five PCs, sometimes reinstalled more than once, so let's say up to 20 installations. I have transferred my backed up data drive contents to each new one that I use. The last thing I want is to be prevented from accessing and "owning" my own files!

As far as I can tell, the whole permissions and ownership thing is fine on the OS drive (and gets reset to a new user each time an OS is installed); and also fine is someone only ever has one PC and OS. But if applied to personal data files across so many PCs and OSs, then it's bound to cause problems if it (incorrectly) thinks each user is a different person, when really it is the same one, me, Karl Drinkwater.

#13

This is not meant to be a direct answer to your question.

But I just wanted to show you other solutions for such situation - moving data between/among different machines.

Case 1.
One of our acquaintances had to move his data between 2 households after he divorced. He needed a desktop for his works. He bought a large capacity external HDD and saved his data only on that HDD.

Case 2.
I have a home made NAS (OpenMediaVault) and copy files (photos, video, music, text files, etc) I want to share with my family on it. This is another way to share files provided all machines are connected to the same network.

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#14

I guess case 1 is what I do when I transfer my files to a new PC. Whereas if I reinstall the OS or install a new one, my files are already there on the separate data drive - the new OS needs to access them exactly the same as if they'd been created in that OS, not see them as "owned" by someone else and restrict me (which is, I think, what Linux would do by default, as I found out when it stopped me backing up my files via an emergency Linux version).

In a way, this is my central question: how to stop Linux from seeing my files as "owned" by someone else if I access them from a different OS (e.g. a fresh install, new PC, different distro or whatever). And the only way to do that, as far as I can tell, is to make sure the permissions don't restrict the files/folders only to the current OS user.

#15

[Re: case 2 - none of my family are in my house or town, I'm just thinking about general shares via USB sticks, email, Google drive etc - maybe I share my document of recipes or some pictures or something, I wouldn't want them to get blocked from making changes to the files.]

#16

That really surprises me.
Unless those files are saved in HOME directory, there should be no ownership attached to the files in the external drive.

I have a multimedia drive which I can access from any machines I have here (3 laptops + 2 desktops) regardless of the OS on them.

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#17

Interesting, none of the stuff I read made that clear. Even in the posts above I thought I was clear that I was mainly referring to my data drive, not my OS drive. Is there any way to confirm that all the files and folders on my data drive have the same permissions and ownership? That's why I thought (due to them being created in so many places over the years) that running a single command on that drive would make sure that everything was fine, every folder and file with the correct permissions. Then, if I can also store my Desktop on that drive in its own folder, I'd be fine. That's what I'm after, making sure that drive is accessible for me from any OS, with no different historic permissions on anything.

#18

You could have your HOME directory on the external drive.
It does not have to be in the default location.

Some users prefer to have a separate partition or a separate drive for their HOME directory.

In this case scenario, each file can have a permission issue since HOME directory is essentially a part of the OS.

But if you never have your external drive in such configuration, there should not be any permission issue. At least that was my experience since the time I used Ubuntu 8.

I have no answer to that question, since I've never experienced this issue myself.
I hope other forum volunteers can answer your question.

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#19

I'm pretty sure your drive is mounted on boot, correct? Open a terminal and type:

sudo gedit /etc/fstab

In the window that opens you are looking for where it is mounted (/mnt/[volume label]), which will be after the uuid (a long number with dashes in it sort of like windows registry keys). You will see a group of 3 or 4 numbers, that is your permissions for the mount. It will have something similar to 007 or 0007, yours may be different. Change this value to all 0's. Save and reboot for it to take effect.

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#20

Ah, so permissions/ownership can be applied to a drive (/dev) rather than the folders and files (/mnt)? I'm confused by how the OS can summaries a whole drive if (potentially) the files and folders on it all have different permissions? Sorry if I missed the point there!

Screenshot from 2021-11-11 16-21-52
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Thanks - this is what I see. Wow, that is a lot of codewords! I'm not sure which is my data drive partition, since that appears as /mnt/sda2/Data in Nautilus.
(Yes, the drive is always there when I am in the OS, so is mounted at boot. Its the one I keep all my files on so I use it continuously.)

#21

Line 13, after auto add: umask=0000
Make sure to have space before and after (not touching auto or nosuid)

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#22

Sorry, I'm lost about what to type into the terminal - I'm new to this. :frowning:
Also, the articles I looked at said 0 = no permissions, 7 = all, so wouldn't 0000 be the opposite of what I need?
I just want to make sure all the files and folder on my data drive (not the OS drive) won't ever lock me out if I reinstall the OS, copy them to a new PC, access them via an emergency USB OS etc.

#23

I checked my currently mounted external drive in fstab:

My entry is like this
(drive UUID) / ext4 errors=remount-ro 0 1

I saw your drive is set to
0 0

While mine is
0 1

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#24

I'm really sorry, I have no idea what the numbers mean! Permissions etc is a total mystery to me. The more I read, the less I can get my head round how it translates into real world scenarios like mine ... :frowning:

#25

I wonder what @Aravisian might think about your fstab.

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#26

It's an octal not the regular permission numbers and is equivalent to 777. You can look it up online.

I gave you everything you need to make it work....in steps....so I'm not doing it again. You were in the file as root...so you followed them fine once.

Good Luck

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#27

Aravisian thinks that Karl has a very good reason to be paranoid.

But... is being paranoid and over-worrying the issue. :wink:

karl, I think that given your profession as an author, with a large number of essential files, you fear that you will lose permissions to these files and lose access to them. This will not happen.
The Worst Case Scenario would actually be only that you may not have read / write access to a file on a separate drive. While annoying, this is not only not data loss, but due to its very nature cannot create data loss. You are actually more secure.
What you want it to eliminate the annoyance.
But first, we must establish whether or not you have this annoyance. Can you clarify this?

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