True, only a handful of distros looks good out of the box. It seems there aren't many artists in the setting up the default of many distros and you can see it's programmers who does it (see lack of artistic inside).
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One thing that I like about Zorin OS is the attention to detail to the look and feel. The way I see it, it's better to impress people by how easy and intuitive things are, than with flashy animations and icons. One other distribution that I really like in this regard is Tromjaro. They even made the decision to replace Gnome with XFCE explicitly for this purpose. Although I think it's just one developer, and I'm not sure how it's going these days. Also, based on Manjaro which I'm not a big fan of.
It's sad that Zorin OS is moving away from this but again, I hope to see things improve from here on in their Core offering. The alternative is that we're witnessing Zorin OS at it's peak, rolling downhill.
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I contacted Tony George and he has started a reddit blog. He suggested I post there if I wanted to. Here's the link: https://www.reddit.com/r/teejeetech/
If we had a way of contacting other Asmi users maybe we could use that blog as a forum to help each other. The biggest problem I have had is finding technical programs that work with Asmi if they aren't already in his software store. I had to try 4 different versions of Cura before I found one that actually worked with Asmi. Hopefully when the new version is released it will solve some of that.
To say something again:
The Way they make this Announcement isn't the best Way I think. That they say it 5 Years before is a good Thing but the whole Way of ... how can I say that ... hiding it, is a bit weird. I mean, they explain her Step. You don't have to share the Points that they made, but it is an Explanation.
But: I mean, it is not (now) an official Blog Article. They packed it in a Link at the Bottom of the Download Website. And when they will support xfce for Zorin 17 and 18 I would think there is no Reason to seperate it that Way they do. They could pack it to the other Stuff like before.
But they put it all to another Place. For me it feels a little bit like ... an unloved Toy. I hope You understand how I mean that. The Way how they do it feels a bit harsh.
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There's another pretty distro based on Manjaro: BigLinux.
At the page, there's a language box.
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I also found this very strange, almost like not even they believe in their own product. Not exactly a comforting of a bright future.
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Hello:
Regarding Linux Mint XFCE I recognize that visually it is not very attractive, however, on youtube there are several tutorials that indicate how to customize it to, in this way, be able to improve its appearance.
Precisely one of the strengths of the Linux Mint Project is its ease of customization. There are many tools available for this purpose.
Greetings.
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Wow, poor Child! The Swim Ring is so close but so far.
Many of us previously commented that Zorin Lite was marketed in a way as to make it sound inferior. Indeed, many newcomers were led to believe that "Lite" offered less than Core and was only for use on older hardware.
The way that this was announced comes across as sideways. It was pointed to as a link to the moderators but not stated, nor commented on. Merely, "17.1 is now released with this announcement here (link.) You had to follow the linked embedded in the word "here" to learn it.
To me, it adds to the feeling that Zorin OS 17 is funneling its users into a narrower ideal of GnuLinux.
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Well, there is a great wailing and gnashing of teeth going on here, all over a DE that appears in a number of other distributives. I paid for Zorin 15, and afterwards left due to a moderator here and his PM to me over a matter. It is what it is, no hurt feelings, I moved on to Mint. Mint was great but has its nuances and sometimes can be cantankerous. Thus, I moved on to Debian XFCE and have been quite happy since then.
The action taken by Zorin Group, reminds me of actions I have seen from other companies that were soon sold, or went into a co-development deal with another company. I am not saying this is the intent of ZG as I have no idea. ZG will do what ZG believes is in the best interest of the organisation and that has to be respected.
People have to decide what is best for their emotional and spiritual health, if fighting for and dying under an OS flag, any OS flag, works for you then go for it. Otherwise, it is better to move on for your own well-being and for the well-being of members that choose to remain users of the OS and its forum.
Best regards
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There is much worth fighting for, and those that fight for our choices and freedoms are the ones you should thank instead of belittle. What world would you live in if everyone agreed "it is better to move on for your own well-being and for the well-being of members that choose to remain users". One without choices and freedom, a world of corporations that take whatever they want. One where abuses go unchallenged.
I would like to add a little clarity:
Whether or not Zorin OS provides a copy of XFCE4 does not in itself limit our choices. Any user can install XFCE or Cinnamon or Plasma... In fact, many of us have done so for years without any discontent.
A lack of Zorin OS Lite may mean a lack of new Zorin Lite themes, but the existing ones could still be used.
What we are looking at is a Line of choices that make a statement about the current state of GnuLinux.
This thread is about - Alternatives -
Alternatives can be important. It allows a freer market, user choices, competition and these add to higher quality, less monopolization and less restrictions. For how long will we have these alternatives as distros drop support for them?
A market that is dominated by one entity or monopoloy is problematic. It is difficult to hold one sole provider responsible or accountable.
By dropping public support for variety and diversity, the ZorinGroups decision makes a public statement.
Already, a post has been made that demonstrates that the reason a reader might think XFCE was discontinued was because it was unnecessary, broken or inferior.
As any distro drops support for our competitive and varied alternatives, this reduces the applicability of having our variety across GnuLinux as a whole.
It makes the statement that we do not need these choices, any more.
It makes a statement that One choice is Better.
It makes a statement that the diversity and choices are no longer relevant.
And as this happens - we lose these choices.
The ZorinGroup - as The Developers - are perceived as knowledgeable authority. And a choice they make or a preference that they show is perceived as knowledgeable and authoritative.
Let me give an example of how powerful this is and how it deeply affects us all.
When Debian first considered whether to adopt SystemD, the consensus was "no." But one of their top developers pushed very hard for it and in the end, they took it on his authority that it was better, resolved issues and was good.
Only, it turned out that he had never even tested SystemD or looked over the code.
One of the key SystemD developers - was a friend of his.
So he pushed for it. He took it on his friends authority, Debian took it on his authority, everyone else took it on Debians authority... "They must know what they are talking about..." and the simple reality was that they were pals and he never even tested it at all.
And now we are all stuck with SystemD and Pulseaudio sound and integrated system services bloating our Operating Systems.
I am fine with having SystemD as a choice. MXLinux lets you choose - Sysvinit or SystemD, take your pick. They do not choose for you.
I am not fine with Distro Developer asserting monopolization, dominance and restrictions.
Is Gnome now equal to XFCE in lightweight system resource usage? That's... new.
If a person is going to assert this, it would have to mean that Recent changes and developments in Gnome make this possible; which is so new as to not be trustworthy. And if a person is going to make these assertions, they must provide benchmarking evidence to back that up since the claim contradicts the mountains of existing evidence that say otherwise.
I do not feel that the ZorinGroup are the baddies. They are not the villains.
What I do feel is that they are leading us with leading words. I feel that my trust has been broken.
They openly and specifically said that they will never limit the Zorin OS users.
Then they make choices that apply limits the Zorin OS users.
Repeatedly.
We are being told, silently, what we want. What we should accept. What we should have on our computers. With action statements, not written ones.
I cannot ethically show support to a distro that fails to show support to the wider GnuLinux community. We need the support and help to preserve and protect our diversity and choices and freedoms because the Big Players disregard feedback and push their will onto us.
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Then the code a new desktop or new things will be doing from us a slaves with no choices the end user?
Like the opinion us is nothing a worth a penny.
Something like a food chain.
I am not sure how the Zorin community became so angered by the developers discontinuing the Lite Xfce version? I agree perhaps a bit better communications would have been better but that is their call to make and a year seems like good advance notice. The current Zorin Lite 16.3 is still supported for 12 months giving users ample time to find another Xfce distribution or just adding the desktop to the current 17.1 Core/Pro/Education version. Seems like a lot of drama for something that happens in open source projects at some point. Change happens and sometimes not everyone can be made happy.
I think you keep missing the point raised by many here. It wasn't WHAT they have done. It was HOW they have done it.
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I don’t want to add any fuel to the fire. Zorin 16.3 Lite Xfce is still good for 12 months. It is their distribution. They decide how to devote resources to make Zorin how they want it.
It is possible they decided that based on time available and donations received plus other factors we may not be aware of, they can’t support two desktops. This kind of thing is common in the open source world.
Maybe if now all cost and price for everything go up it propably gived a cut cost on maintaining servers, working on two systems where xfce is a small % people.
That could be happens. Now everyone count a penny.
This is something like a the painter and the portrait he painted.
For some it may be a masterpiece and delight, but for others it may not exist.
If they decided that they no longer want to create the Zorin Lite distribution, ok, I will understand it, but without an explanation?
Why did they make this decision?
I mean, reading about the upcoming sunset doesn't mean anything to me. It's like selling someone a fairy tale about paradise.
We don't live in the Middle Ages these days.
A bit better communication?
-
For a very long time, users have legitimately questioned the ZorinGroups lack of communication
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For a very long time, users have legitimately questioned the ZorinGroups exceptional delays.
Zorin Core is worked on and released, then work started on Lite and it is released after, so reducing to just Core does not reduce the development time.
Zorin Grid was proposed four years ago. Two years ago, the ZorinGroup tentatively stated that they hoped to release it in 2022.
The Zorin Direct Upgrade option lagged behind for years. At no point did the ZorinGroup release any Roadmap, nor did the choose to update their User Base until heavily pressured to make a comment.
We have to push and beg and plead for tidbits of information.
These are valid and legitimate concerns for a user base to have and the users showed exceptional forgiveness and patience during years long waits.
This is not an act of cruelty by ungrateful wretches.
- The straw that broke the camels back. It is the decision made that follows a series of ZorinGroup decisions that adds into user discontent.
Zorin 17 brought a lot of significant changes. It was a lot for the user base to assimilate. Many of these changes were of known contentious issues within the GnuLinux community as a whole. For example, the adoption of Wayland as a default and the promotion and replacement of Flatpak over APT. They are big deals, and after reeling from that, we got hit with, "Oh by the way, in a sideways announcement, we are dropping support for other desktops, too."
This does not mean that the user base should ever be expected to not voice discontent or protest a move made by the developers.
Remember that the developers only and sole reason for developing is to provide for the user base. The user base is not providing for the developers. We do not serve them, they serve us. Without a user base (customers), the developers have nothing.
Not everyone protests the decision. You don't. This does not mean that those that do are somehow wrong because you are not unhappy.
The ZorinGroup introduced the Lite edition in 2009 With Zorin OS 2, fifteen years ago. That is a decade and a half. If Zorin OS Lite was in itself, some kind of financial burden or time constraint, it would have been a problem a long time ago. Not after Zorin OS grew in popularity and revenue.
Importantly, when the ZorinGroup raised the price for Ultimate (later Pro), they doubled the price. They justified this decision based on Pro including Lite Pro.
Will the price of Pro be lowered to account for the lack of Lite Pro?
Zorin OS Lite was changed from LXDE to XFCE. There was no "drama."
Zorin OS Ultimate was changed to Zorin OS Pro. There was no "drama."
Zorin OS Pro stopped providing the Ultimate Games. There was no "drama."
What differentiates uhh... "drama" and reception is how significant a change is and how the users are affected. Are we to shut up and be silent when we are affected by decisions made for us and our behalf? Zorin OS is a project for the Users. They are not doing it for their health.
Why are we here? Shouldn't we all go back to Microsoft Windows, bow our heads and accept our lickings?
Let's just all do away with this GnuLinux foolishness and take our medicine.
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I agree that developers can make whatever decision they see fit about their project.
Notwithstanding the above, there is a minimum of respect for the community, which is what gives sustainability to the project.
It is true that there have been distributions whose developers have decided to make changes, however, they have done it in a transparent way, publishing in the main part of their web page the reasons that led them to make this decision. Here everything is different, half hidden; besides the arguments they give are not very convincing, the Gnome desktop is heavy, it does not compare with XFCE which is much lighter.
I have installed Zorin Os Core on an old laptop with limited resources and it barely runs, even though I have disabled all the inherent features, such as multitasking and cube.
I think it's more of a resource problem (you have to consider how long it took them to release the current version).
One of the things I have always criticized the Zorin brothers for is the lack of timely communication to their community. We never know when the new version will be released, what aspects it will include, etc.
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