Valve usually keeps up well, but there have been occasions where GE-Proton (I don't know why, but it's not called Proton-GE anymore) was necessary for a period of time. Right after Diablo 4 came out, for example, Valve's Proton wouldn't run it, but Glorious Eggroll did. Also, I can easily install GE-Proton for use with Bottles and Heroic, and have no idea how I'd export Valve's runners to use outside of Steam. Accordingly, GE-Proton is indispensable to me. If most of your games are native or in Steam, I can see why you wouldn't need it.
Some games refuses to play game videos with valve proton, with proton-ge it’s working just fine. Most of the time i use valve proton, but if videos dont play i need ge.
Sample:
https://www.reddit.com/r/SteamDeck/comments/16vgj4y/why_do_videos_sometimes_look_like_this_in_some/
I completely misread your first sentence. I thought you said "I am not a fan of proton-ge," which is why I replied the way I did. Sorry about that; I was working until 5:30 am and had to get back to it at 10 am. Not completely awake!
1 Like
In respect of E-live I haven't kept up with developments, but he usually uses older kernels than other distributions and also software.
In respect of Slax, that was never installable, 'just' a live OS which I never realised until reading a discourse about it online.
The one person that gets my vote is Glenn Cady, known as 'Thee Mahn' of Ultimate Edition fame, and the spin-offs from the land of Oz. His last major project was Arch based and a 'self-healing OS'.
But ultimately, my hat tips to Bill Reynolds, aka Texstar, the man behind PCLinuxOS, Texstar because I suspect he is from the state of Texas, and the logo of the distribution is I think, a Texas longhorn (bull). Apart from PCLOS he was a major contributor to Mandrake, and has also from what I have garnered, worked alongside Devuan. So why Texstar? Well he certainly knows how to reduce bloatware in the Plasma release, no Discover, just Synaptic Package Manager and the command line. Consistent across all desktop environments that come from PCLOS has no systemd and no elogind. Whilst the latter is not part of systemd, elogind devs have acknowledged the influence of systemd in its creation. The only downside for me was that it was rpm based and I had to downgrade my videocard to a GT440 with 1 Gb RAM from a GT1030 with 2 Gb RAM. The forum members of PCLOS are outstanding. Some packages that I could not get working they recompiled to .rpm and provided an installation script for me to use.
In respect of which GNU/Linux distros charge for their OS, my first one I paid for a 'special release' was Vector Linux, basically a donation for 2 CD isos, and I think was £20. Then later I paid £40+ for SuSE Linux 9.3 Professional. I still have it. I got a large wallet of CD's with KDE and Gnome DE's. My interest in it was down to the fact it was at the time the leading distro for incorporating a screen reader due to my employment as a Vision Support Technician. Back then the voices were quite feeble and not as professional as current voices for Orca.
In the US you had Linspire, and I think they charged something like $79 US. Xandros, who Michael Robertson sold Linspire to, were charging something ridiculous like $400 US for their own OS.
Linspire is actually back on the market, but bears no resemblance to the original version based on Debian with a KDE style desktop.
The cost of Linspire is $29.99 for a digital download, and $32.99 for a physical copy. What is interesting is it appears BlackLab have also still making Xandros too!
2 Likes
@Bourne I adjusted the thread title to frame it as an actual question, rather than a statement.
2 Likes
No worries, believe me when i say i have that too sometimes 
.
I created a “ventoy” usb, never used that tool and i am quite impressed with it. Will try nobara on my oldest notebook.
1 Like
I always liked reading your criticism about what is going here.
I know you many times was upset about changing things in linux world and devs. We agree with that but if nobody hearing our voice then who will be speaking? Intelligence Artificielle or chat bot what are not properly and often lieying?
I think the main problem here is that we evaluate cost in terms of money when software corporations are more interested in Data Monetization and with poor security, can lead to ID theft.
1 Like
I am unpopular in that I believe that Free means Freedom, not cost.
I think that GnuLinux software should have a price tag. While developers making software out of the goodness of their hearts sounds very Star Trek, the reality is that humans are not altruistic.
Companies learned already that offering "free cost" products and services turns the customer into a marketable product. From spyware, to data sales, we became a commodity.
This is too tempting in the GnuLinux ecosystem and we already are beginning to feel its effects.
All the warning signs and red flags are flashing and waving in the air.
And we, human beings that are absorbed in self interest and lacking altruism, wish to turn a blind eye to all that flashing and waving because We Want Free Cost.
We humans are fine with someone else doing hard work that we benefit from and them not getting paid; as long as it does not happen to us.
If it happens to us, we get angry an demand payment.
1 Like
Fair warning, Nobara may not like your oldest, depending on how old it is. It's an openly "opinionated" distribution based on Fedora. Steam is included; there's no option to not install it. Significantly customized kernel. Its stated goal is to make Fedora easier to get going without having to jump through hoops getting started. I like it, but you can really see that it's just one guy handling it on things like the system updater. (UI, I'm not saying it's buggy.)
I'm with you for the most part. My second experiment with Linux in the 90s was Mandrake, which at the time came as a boxed product at Electronics Boutique, before said chain became more pawn shop than anything else. I paid $40 for Zorin Pro, and I think I paid something similar for Mandrake.
Where it gets to be a tough sell is the question of how that money makes it upstream. When adding the graphics-drivers PPA, for example, there's a gentle request for donations if I remember correctly, and that's entirely reasonable. The thing is, if I toss just $2 to every person or group making part of what ultimately becomes my OS (using that term slightly too inclusively here to mean "all software I have to make my computer do what I want it to do, and no software that is my main purpose for owning my computer"-- so drivers are OS and games aren't for the limited purpose of this illustration), I will very swiftly end up eating instant ramen for every meal. If my free software is to have a cost, the problem of equitable distribution to those who make it possible needs to be solved, and needs to be on the backs of those selling the product.
Put another way, I should pay personally for Calibre, Zorin, and LibreOffice, and they should distribute fairly to those whose work enabled theirs. I feel like this will get immensely complex and inequitable before long, and that's before figuring out how to pay for Dolphin installed on GNOME. Normally, the distro using KDE should share upstream in my example. Now, I'm accessing upstream directly and the onus is on me. Suddenly, the web is even more complicated as the end points (users) need to connect at multiple levels.
I agree people should be paid for their work. I think limited monetization is a driving reason behind UI approachability lagging behind Windows (I chose that word carefully; I'm not saying it's hard; I'm saying programmer UI and man pages are off-putting to many), and it's just plain the fair thing to do.
I really don't have the time or money to manage a thousand $2-5/mo. subscriptions, and my $2 won't keep work going if it's one time.
I apologize if this comes off as too stream of consciousness. This is a rough week for sleep, and I'm composing this on my phone, not yet out of bed.
3 Likes
I'm fine with paid software for Linux. I paid for SoftMaker Office.
And a few other pieces of software, too. It's all good. Supports Linux.
Edward Snowden revealed:
information about the PRISM program, which allows for mass eavesdropping on conversations of Americans and citizens of other countries, conducted via VoIP telephone and the Internet. According to Snowden, PRISM allows the National Security Agency to view e-mail, access chats and video chats, and obtain information from social networking sites. The PRISM program involves Microsoft (Hotmail), Google (Gmail and YouTube), Yahoo!, Facebook, Skype, AOL, Apple Inc., and Paltalk[8][9].
a copy of a secret FISC court decision of April 25, 2013, according to which one of the main American mobile network operators, Verizon, is required to provide the National Security Agency with metadata on all calls, both domestic and international, daily, including the telephone numbers of the caller and the recipient, the IMEI of the phones, the date and time, the length of the call, and the location from which the call was made[10].
that the United States services spied on European Union institutions and over 30 leading politicians in the world. Among others, the persons eavesdropped on may have been: the mobile phone of the then German Chancellor Angela Merkel[11].
that since 2009, American secret services have been illegally accessing the computer networks of the East Asian network Pacnet, as well as Chinese mobile operators, in order to gain access to the content of millions of text messages. According to a statement by the Hong Kong newspaper Sunday Morning Post, he provided the editorial office with documents confirming this fact[12].
information about the existence of the British surveillance program Tempora and announced that he does not use iPhones, because they have integrated software that allows users to be tracked. Instead of smartphones, Snowden uses ordinary mobile phones[13].
Ok. Maybe if I looking that from another side.
I f we know the food, electric current cost go up. That we can understable the Zorin to exist need a electric and some tools software also PC.
We cannot be selfish. Trying discussion to solve problem or answear why it is have that price. The people spend time to write this product. Spend lower time with family. We know if brothers Zorin first version created when they are was younger. That mean't they are intelligent and creativity. Why we always must blame something or cannot find correct answear. The world is changing, the people changing, technology changing. Why you cannot sayed Zorin is very good distribution from Hannah Montana Linux and etc. Why we always need repeat that is support a devs project? It depends which side you looking then you can always fing good and bad things. This is mostly depends for folk with diffrent preferences.
In getting back to the actual topic of this thread ... I would say that Zorin is not more expensive than Windows. Two things: 1) The regular retail price of Windows costs far more than Zorin. Sale prices don't really count. The regular, intended price is what truly counts. That's how I'm looking at it. And 2) Don't forget, as a whole, Windows is almost inherently more expensive than Zorin to use. There's paid antivirus, paid photo editors, and so on. Yes, Windows has freeware, but the options for paid software are far more plentiful than for Linux, and therein is further potential for Windows to be ultimately more costly to use. We don't need antivirus for Linux. We don't need a firewall for Linux. And so on and on. So the premise of this whole topic is shaky at best when you account for everything I've just said (especially the regular retail price for Windows). The whole thing's a non-sequitur.
Moving on ...
Well it is maybe not fair Zorin taken conclusion with windows or macOS? Maybe the question would be need if is more expensive from another linux distributions what have only one desktop enviroments? Maybe is better from arch because is stable?
Agreed; This is getting far off topic of this thread.
I do not wish to detract from your sharing of information by removing the post.
But please stay on topic from this point forward.
Ok. I just want taken a question what is opened and trying to understable people and start thinking why Zorin is acceptable with that price or not. Blog Zorin webside don't talking to much. I know often people reading forum some distribution linux to get answear why it is good idea buying a Zorin Pro. I would like this conversation not like a war battle on some district zone with nonsense arguments. I can sayed Zorin is for beginners the people who want learning a linux distribution. I know when I was a "green potato" - many times asking her for help to understable things when I broken something. That is good conclusion. The same example maybe little stupid if I buying clothes for comfortable,warm in winter time, cotton material etc. The diffrents Core and Pro are minimal you get a support. Anything what is installing all software in Pro can be found in Core version. The magic with Pro is you get finished many desktop enviroments. I liked people here on forum very sincerely if that correct word, nice helpfull.
1 Like
Noticed that, it refused the live boot. Installed endeavor os on it for testing. The distro looks oke but i have alot of issues with lutris. Things that works out of the box with pop os, i have to manually install in endeavor os.
I am not bot what Nobara have some cons in my main question?
It does have some cons, yes. Like I said, it's "opinionated." It doesn't try to be minimalist; it doesn't try to be for everyone. It's Wayland only, but Wayland works MUCH better on Nobara than it does on Zorin in my experience. It circumvents some problems with Wayland and screen sharing by making it much easier to install Discord Canary, which is Discord's beta version, because the beta version works better with Wayland. It also goes ahead and uses RPMFusion packages from the very beginning, instead of optionally, which some people may not like. I didn't use OBS on my last hop to Nobara, but my recollection is that Nobara's flatpak OBS is different from The OBS Project's official flatpak.
If you've been reading news recently, you may be aware that The OBS Project recently threatened to sue Fedora over Fedora using a customized package. (Fedora by default, hosts its own flatpak repositories instead of using Flathub.) The Fedora version had some significant breakage and it was causing support headaches for The OBS Project upstream, since Fedora didn't make it obvious in any way that their version was customized. I don't know if Nobara uses Fedora's OBS or the official Flatpak, but if it uses Fedora's, that could be an issue. Fortunately, Fedora and OBS managed to work things out and the legal threats are on hold, pending some changes from Fedora to fix up the version they provide.
Otherwise, the only real cons I've noted in Nobara are that it's got some rough edges as a result of being a one man project, and that since it's Fedora based, one needs to accept the learning curve of dealing with a different package manager. The last time I tried using Fedora itself, I ran into a lot of issues that I felt should have been possible to resolve with one or two clicks, like installing Nvidia drivers. Nobara takes care of a LOT of that mess. It is my preferred Fedora distribution, but it really does make some decisions for the user. I haven't experimented to see how well it holds up if the user tries to revert those decisions.
2 Likes