Merit of idle RAM tangent

At idle? Who operates their machine at idle?

Try Performance.

There is currently zero data that I can find that compares Gnome 43 or up against the lightweight desktops. I can find no benchmarks, just a lot of speculation based on the fact that Gnome has improved efficiency, and so people predict it will continue to do so and assume that other desktops will not and will stay stagnant (for some reason. Oh, wait... I remember the reason - because they are pushing Gnome).

What benchmarks we do have of existing setups shows that under use, XFCE outperforms Gnome by far on CPU usage, temps, RAM consumption and speed.
To this day.

And if benchmarks are not your thing, just browse the forum and note how many Core freezes, crashing, lag are reported in comparison to Z Lite, in spite of the sheer number of Lite users.

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I draw a line between enjoying a perspective for ones ego and using a perspective as a benchmark of reality to try to persuade others.
Especially so when it misrepresents data in order to bolster support for a product or to remove support from a perfectly good option.

Mine can sit idle for lengthy periods of time. :stuck_out_tongue:
But if we are going to benchmark performance, no part of RAM at idle is part of any valid performance test.

It was a direct response to this statement:

But any person that engages in that fallacy can have my words above applied.

And nowhere have I done so. And you would be unable to find nor quote any post nor statement that faults new users for choosing Zorin OS anywhere on this forum. In fact, you can find many recent posts that users have made expressing appreciation for Zorin OS with a "Like" from me on their post.

My posts have been 100% on topic - referring to the clear fallacy of thinking that looking at RAM at idle is some kind of benchmark (it is not) or that it indicates Desktop Performance (it in no way does).
Indeed, I spelled out exactly and clearly how it is that different computers can show different RAM used at idle - the simplest being that a system will use the specs provided on the hardware. If more RAM is available in the slots, the system certainly will make use of it.

You appear to have put words into my mouth and are trying to turn this into some kind of personal argument.

What matters is evidence and the merit of the data. And while you do try to turn this into some personal beef, you provide zero data, nor any benchmarks to demonstrate that Gnome actually is equivalent to other desktops in performance, nor has anyone else.
I maintain that the data is what is important. Not your axe or my axe...

This is not a fallacy by any measure. To state that opinions or perspective have validity is perfectly reasonable. To say that the data is inadmissible is not reasonable.

I will now remind you of the guidelines of this forum.

  • Do not turn threads into personal arguments or attack the character or person. Instead, focus on the merit of the ideas. Attack the idea, not the person.

I believe that any person reading my posts can see that I make the following points - without defensiveness:

  • Idle RAM at CPU is in no way a benchmark, nor a valid test, nor is it used by experts as a test.
  • Dismissiveness toward options in GnuLinux harms the users and limits choice.

No defensiveness can be seen - until you made personal attacks.

Or you can - until such time you decide to follow the forum guidelines.
Again, it is true that my personal preferences and position have been separate from the ZorinGroups and have been for many years. This is amicable and just because people disagree, does not make them enemies.
Member and Users opinions on the Direction of Zorin OS abound, are very diverse and are not all delegated to pure fandom. The Feedback subforum is an excellent place to peruse this great variety.

And it is true I disagree with the ZorinGroups decision to drop support for other Desktop Environments providing exclusivity only to Gnome. Due to this, I dropped Technical Support for Zorin OS. But I did not drop Member Support and as such, I still provide assistance in many ways to the members of this forum.

Please refrain from the hostility, accusatory and personal attacks in any thread you visit, whether you refrain from posting further in this one or not.
Members disagree with me, disagree with the Zorins, disagree with each other amicably all the time without engaging in this sort of behavior.

This is "clean-up" of this thread. I have moved the posts from that thread to this publicly viewable thread.
@rybo took action using his profile settings to delete the posts I responded to after the replies. The member was not banned nor subject to any administrator action other than the informal warning seen in the post above this one.

A post was merged into an existing topic: What is your idle RAM and CPU usage?

Your speech about systemd everywhere in this forum is also political enough. :expressionless:

Taking time out of your day to post a complaint about what another member says or giving their feedback is 100% no different from another member saying something or giving their feedback.

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I have some affection for Zorin OS, but little interest in the individual components used in it. I am happy with whatever components are used, as long as the end result is a good distro. My views may be unusual, and I am sorry that some people may be offended by them.

Who has expressed being offended by your views about Zorin OS and how can we address that?

Many users are content with SystemD, possibly causing it to be so widespread and pervasive. I certainly understand the merit of the arguments against it. I understand the merits in the arguments in favor of it - however I often find them wanting. I tolerate SystemD, but I do so fully aware of how its entanglement makes my usage of a GnuLinux system harder.
Your views do not appear to be unusual, but quite usual.

It was Swarfendors stated views against SystemD that looked to me to draw offense.
If a person is content with the components, whether the desktop or the init system, then they can brush right past comments that they do not wish to read. For many of us, we discuss this in public in order to share views and spread awareness about issues that GnuLinux users may need to understand and know about. It can be passionate - and that is ok.

It is a fact of life that when something is important to a person, having another person chide them for the passion never helps that person or leads to a good result.
Just food for thought. I am moving these further off topic posts to the tangent thread.

Whilst this is historical, it is also relevant as to my standpoint on systemd:

And more recently:

As of this, I just want to point out:

Even windows can run at 0% CPU at idle if your hardware is powerful enough and you wait for most of windows's background processes (like windows update) to finish

And from my own personal experience: In my old laptop, last time I checked, debian with KDE Plasma and some widgets in the desktop consumed double the RAM compared to a fresh Zorin Core install with gnome, but on Zorin temperatures were always above 40ºC on idle and performance on use was very poor, while the other had the fans stop spinning even when I'm doing something relatively simple ON USE (libreoffice, reading a pdf...) while still having way better performance when doing heavier things like web browsing with firefox

RAM usage tells the amount of data needed to run the system, not the efficiency of it. You can build the largest computer ever with 1 TB of RAM, but if you use an old Intel Celeron for the processor, performance is still going to be bad, no matter how much ram your pc has

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I am no stranger to the infamy of systemd and other technologies. If you keep looking for reasons why others don't understand you to be ignorant of others, you will become less and less understood. Just because something is right does not mean that any sacrifice is acceptable. What is right varies from person to person, and resources are limited.

It is not productive to repeat the same arguments and I cannot help but discourage them.

@Hackgets, I have sent you a Private Message with a moderator note.

On topic:
Many readers do not log in daily or a few times a week. It is productive for the forum as a whole when members are passionate in their views on GnuLinux to post often since this keeps these topics at the top visible to everyone.
Even if you disagree with anothers views on GnuLinux.

Sysvinit is simple, stable and solid. There is no suggestion anywhere of making "any sacrifice".

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